Speaker 1:
From the library of the New York Stock Exchange at the corner of Wall and Broad Streets in New York City, you're inside the ICE House. Our podcast from Intercontinental Exchange on markets, leadership and vision and global business, the dream-drivers that have made the NYSE an indispensable institution of global growth for over 225 years. Each week, we feature stories of those who hatch plans, create jobs and harness the engine of capitalism. Right here, right now at the NYSE and at ICE's Exchanges and Clearing Houses around the world. And now, welcome. Inside the ICE House. Here's your host, Josh King of Intercontinental Exchange.
Josh King:
The 140th US Open was played this year, here in Queens, at the USTA's Billie Jean King National Tennis Center, which finished on September 13th with Dominic Thiem of Austria taking the men's singles title and Naomi Osaka of Japan taking the women's title. A total of $53 million in prize money was awarded, with each winner taking home a purse of $3 million, the runner-up half that at 1.5 million. The trophies were awarded at Center Court in the Arthur Ashe Stadium, in front of approximately zero spectators, for the first time in the tournament's history and the first time in all of the Grand Slam tournament's 143 year history. All due, of course, to COVID-19. But let's head back, say, 43 years.
Josh King:
It's August 1977. The Son of Sam is terrorizing New York city. The city's just endured the historic blackout on July 13th, plunging the five boroughs into darkness. Still, in tennis, as always, the show must go on. And that means the best players in the world head to their prime clay court tuneup for Forest Hills, the U.S. Pro Championships to the Longwood Cricket Club in Chestnut Hill, Massachusetts. And there, at that moment, is 12-year-old me, in all of my tennis-loving glory. Taking the T-Stop near Longwood, grabbing my tickets, scanning the brackets and watching the greats in their all whites, all day long as the fans progressively fill the stands. The men's doubles that year; Bob Lutz and Stan Smith defeat Brian Gottfried, my personal favorite at the time, and South Africa's Bob Hewitt. Really, there were few days like that in my memory, that I enjoyed so much.
Josh King:
So, back at the present. Here I am, in the thinly populated New York Stock Exchange, not wearing my usual business suit, but rather an open collar shirt, Bonobos pants and a pair of bright white classic Stan Smith sneakers from Adidas, 56 years after the first model, not yet named for Mr. Smith, was first introduced in play. The breakthrough leather design, joining the canvas footwear that then dominated the sport. I own two pair of Stans at the moment, the original green accents, which I'm wearing now, and a special pair with red accents that I take out for special occasions. The idea to buy those planted in my brain when I visited the great Eden Rock Hotel in St Barths a few years ago, and every staff member on the property was similarly appointed in red trimmed Stans.
Josh King:
So, what a pleasure it is to share the mic for a few minutes today with one of my boyhood heroes, the great Stan Smith, the former number one tennis player in the world, the winner of Wimbledon in 1972 over Ilie Năstase, and the aforementioned US Open over Jan Kodeš in 1971 and, of course, those three Longwood doubles crowns in '73, '74 and his 63 - 64 triumph with Mr. Lutz over Gottfried and Hewitt before my very eyes in 1977. And... Oh, yeah, the global fashion icon who has reigned for half a century and still going strong. Our conversation with Stan Smith, all right after this.
Speaker 3:
Board diversity is important.
Speaker 4:
Board diversity is important.
Stan Smith:
Board diversity is important.
Speaker 6:
Board diversity is very important.
Stan Smith:
Not just because it's the right thing to do, but because diverse leadership at companies creates better companies.
Speaker 7:
This is about value, not values.
Speaker 8:
With board diversity, you build better companies.
Speaker 9:
Diversity of thought, diversity of perspective.
Speaker 10:
Different perspectives often yield better outcomes.
Stan Smith:
We need to have different perspectives with different backgrounds to really inform and find the best solutions for our organizations.
Speaker 11:
Companies that have more diverse boards, perform better.
Speaker 6:
Diverse teams are better performers. That is absolutely true in the boardroom as well.
Speaker 10:
It makes a difference to the employees who work for companies. It makes a big difference for the communities in which they work.
Speaker 4:
Our business is about building leaders for the future, and that talent cannot be only half the population of the world.
Speaker 7:
What are you waiting for? 50% of the population, for some reason, isn't qualified. Let's put the smartest people we can, in the boardroom. And why ignore people or to exclude people for any reason other than that they're not qualified?
Josh King:
Our guest today, the legendary Stan Smith, is now President of the International Tennis Hall of Fame in Newport, Rhode Island, along with the titles I mentioned before the break. Stan won, according to the Hall of Fame website, a total of 37 career singles titles, and 53 doubles titles, also representing the US and the Davis Cup team for 10 years, helping to win it seven times. And for that body of work, he was inducted into the International Tennis Hall of Fame in 1987, but still reigns supreme on the feet of men and women around the world. Welcome, Stan, inside the ICE House and the New York Stock Exchange building, that while our history dates back 228 years, our current building, opened in 1904, is still newer than the building you oversee, the Newport Casino, which was opened to summer cottage residence in 1880. Good to have you with us.
Stan Smith:
Well, thank you, Joshua, I appreciate the introduction. And I like to see what you're wearing there, it's very good.
Josh King:
Always, sir. And that red pair I have up state, and I put it on whenever I host my guests, remember that great feeling I had at the Eden Rock when everyone jumped out with their Stans and tucked my bags and handed me a drink and made me feel right at home.
Stan Smith:
I love it. That's great.
Josh King:
So for all those trophies in your trophy case that I'm looking at, sitting behind you, Wikipedia notes that your career prize money, I think, is 1.7 million, which is just a tad over Alexander Zverev's purse at Queens a few weeks ago. What was the prize money back in '71?
Stan Smith:
Well, we had the big prize of $20,000 and a gold ball. There's a couple of gold balls in this trophy cabinet, and I didn't even get a trophy at that time, but I got a warm handshake from the president of the USTA so that was very special.
Josh King:
And what, pray tell, did you and Bob get for winning the U.S. Pro doubles trophy in Chestnut Hill back in '77?
Stan Smith:
I have no idea.
Josh King:
Do you remember any of those visits to Boston?
Stan Smith:
I do remember those. Those were special. In fact, Bud Collins really... I keep telling people that we made him famous, because he was doing the broadcast by himself for seven or eight hours nonstop. I don't know if he ever ate or went to the bathroom, but that was a special place for us. In fact, the first year we played there, we lost on Sunday. They started us on the day before the tournament and we lost. And so we were out of the tournament before it even started, and that was one of the first experiences. But we did have some great experiences there at the Longwood Cricket Club and it's a very special facility. Those grass courts were great. Now they got clay courts as well, and they still have some very good grass courts.
Josh King:
Hey, let's just have a little quick digression on Bud Collins. You mentioned him and I forgot to put him in my flow notes of people that I wanted to talk to you about. But as a kid growing up, reading The Boston Globe, not just about tennis, but everything else that Bud would opine on. For our listeners who have no idea who Bud Collins is, share your reflections on him.
Stan Smith:
Well, Bud and I got to be pretty good friends. He obviously covered the tennis and he covered us, our very first victory there at the Longwood Cricket Club when we played doubles there. But he covered all the tournaments all around the world. I even did TV with him at Wimbledon. He and Dick Enberg were... The three of us were playing, and Charlie Jones. But anyway, we did that broadcast that way, but we also did some trips. We went to China, I went with Arthur to... Actually, to Africa. And then we also went to China together, and with the USTA we had a group of players and media people in 1977, we also went to Vietnam twice, and he was part of that group as well. So Bud was really one of the great colorful media people in tennis.
Stan Smith:
And he had nicknames for everybody. He always wore these bright, various colored pattern pants and no socks, and sandals that he wore. And he was not afraid to do something a little bit different, but he did really bring a lot of interest to the game. He was a great writer. And most of his time was pretty good on the broadcast, although one time we were playing at Newport, Rhode Island, which is where the Hall of Fame is, and it was very foggy. And he was way up in the stands, above the stands on one side. It was so foggy, you couldn't see him, and all you could do is hear him. I think he thought he was God too, but you thought maybe it was God because you heard this voice booming, "It's an ace!" And it was Bud Collins commenting on the serve.
Stan Smith:
And I wanted to turn back and say, "Bud, it's not an ace. I got my racket on it. So it's not considered, really, an ace." But he was great in Africa, he always would get two or three in that African language, wherever country we're in, and introduce Arthur and I before the match and it was one of those words. But he was a colorful guy, great guy, actually. He actually was terrific and helped a lot of people along the way, not only in the television area, but the writers and even the players.
Josh King:
I mean, as a writer, his way with words really helped make that sport popular in those days.
Stan Smith:
Yeah. I mean, he got a nickname for everybody. Fräulein Forehand, you know it's Steffi Graf, and all these different players had a nickname from Bud Collins. And he was a little goofy sometimes, but it did bring interest to the game.
Josh King:
I mean, talking about Arthur and Bob Lutz and those days, as President now of the International Tennis Hall of Fame, give me a few thoughts of the state of the game today.
Stan Smith:
Well, the game is very healthy. I mean, it's hard to say that during COVID, but in general, it's been very healthy. We've got some great male players that are in the game, that are playing, even at their best. I mean, you look at Federer, Nadal and Djokovic, they're playing great tennis. And they may go down as three of the top players ever to play the game. I got Borg in there and Sampras and Laver, but those three guys have made an impact and stamped their legacy in the game.
Stan Smith:
And on the women's side, you've got Serena, who is still there and still trying to go for number 24 to match Margaret Court. But Martina and Chrissie took the mantle from Billy Jean King, and Steffi and... And the women's game is pretty healthy too. There's a lot more depth in the game. And in the men's game as well. You're seeing some great matches in Paris this week, because of young players that have never played in front of a crowd, they're playing in their natural surroundings without anybody watching. And I think it's actually helped some of those guys and girls do well at Roland-Garros.
Stan Smith:
But I think the game in general is pretty healthy, with a lot of good players from all over the world. It's making it difficult for the US to dominate like they have in the past at different times of the game. But we do have some very interesting, fun, talented players from all over the world.
Josh King:
I mean, beyond making Roland-Garros feel like a high school tennis court, what do you think COVID is going to do to tennis at both the pro, amateur and the recreational level?
Stan Smith:
Well, one of the things about tennis is, that it's very safe. We have an academy here, the Smith Stearns Tennis Academy. We've been going all summer and now into the fall for the school year, and the kids are distancing, they're 78 feet apart from baseline to baseline, which is a pretty good distance. And we're trying to keep them from getting too close during their breaks and that sort of thing. But tennis is a safe sport during this COVID time, just like golf is. And so it's really been a boom for tennis and the recreational side of it. The professional tournaments have taken a big hit because many were canceled, and some of these grand slam events like the US Open and Roland-Garros, are playing under very unusual circumstances. And if it weren't for TV, those events would be canceled and the prize money would be dramatically lower.
Stan Smith:
It was lower, 90%, at the US Open and it's even lower, I think, at Roland-Garros. The winner only gained a [00:13:49] million six euros, at the US Open, it was $3 million for the men's and women's winner. But if it hadn't been for TV, I think we'd really be in trouble. The sponsors are being supported by the TV and, of course, there are no fans and no ticket sales. And so it's a very odd time, that we're hoping that more sooner than later, we're going to have fans in the stands.
Josh King:
Stan, with a bunch of spare time on my hands this summer, most public tennis courts closed and a little extra land on my property up state, I had a pickleball court installed. What's pickleball doing to revive racket sports around the world?
Stan Smith:
Well, pickleball's getting very popular, certainly in the United States. And there's a couple, actually, in my neighborhood that were just built. And what's good about that, is that you don't have to move that far, it's mainly a doubles event, and your movement is only a few steps either way. So it's getting people out there, that are tennis players that are playing pickleball, it's getting people who have never played tennis, playing pickleball. And some of those pickleball people will gravitate towards tennis as well. So I think it's helping both, but certainly the pickleball phenomena has been pretty interesting to see.
Josh King:
We certainly keep the court going full time on the weekends. I glossed over so many of your career accomplishments in the intro, Stan, but you even named your autobiography, "Some People Think I'm A Shoe." Did you have any idea that when Adidas asked you to endorse a simple white tennis shoe in the 1970s, that there would be 142 versions still on sale in 2020?
Stan Smith:
It's been a spectacular story over the years, and certainly the first year I made this agreement was a five year deal with Adidas in 1972. And my name went on the shoe in '73 and not only my name, but my photograph was on the tongue. And then Robert HIE, whose name was on the shoe originally, in 1965 he and Horst Dassler created this shoe, and that's Adi Dassler's son. When they wanted to get a little stronger presence in the United States, that's when we started talking, and so my picture's on the shoe, and his name and then different iterations. And it was, I thought, a five or six, 10 year deal, maybe, if fortunate. And lo and behold, it went until 2012 and they took it off the market in 2012 and 13. That meeting when they told us about it in 2011 was a sad day, we walked down to that meeting saying, "Well, it's been a nice long run from '72 to then." And we had no idea what their marketing plan was, but-
Josh King:
Did they know it at the time? Did they have their idea? Did you have a sense that they were kernalizing this thought?
Stan Smith:
They gave us some words, and not much in the way of paper and concrete thoughts, but as it turned out, they came back and they had said some things, they gave us a time schedule. So on January 15th of 2014, they reintroduced it worldwide and after that, it just went crazy. So it's been an interesting journey.
Josh King:
The sneaker I showed you today, Stan, is a far cry from Rafael Nadal's current Nike Air Zoom Cage 3 HC Rafa, which you can get at Amazon for a $129 and 99 cents. But take me back to that moment that you switched from canvas to leather, and really the technological leap that the Stan Smith represented at the time.
Stan Smith:
Well, it was a huge technological leap at that time. And you showed me your shoe and you verified that you're actually wearing that shoe, and that shoe that you're wearing, is very, very similar to the shoe that was created in 1965 by Horst Dasser and Robert Haillet. But at that time, it was such a big deal because we only wore canvas shoes and therefore to go to a leather shoe that was more sturdy, more comfortable, lasted longer, more stylish, in a way, just being white with a little green trim in the back. It was the shoe to wear on the tennis court. And so I started wearing that shoe before I had got involved with them as far as getting my name on the shoe, and because it was the shoe to wear, because it was a big step from the canvas that we wore.
Josh King:
And I understand that the current version itself is making much better use of some recycled materials, to have a little less impact on the landfills?
Stan Smith:
That's exactly right. In fact, I just got a pair just last week, which is using those materials from... Recycled leather and rubber and plastic. Adidas is making a big effort on sustainability and the green look, and so they are really going out and a lot of the products... I just did a book tour when I brought out the book, and one of the stops was in London and Stella McCartney, who has been working in conjunction with Adidas for about seven years, she is vegan and everything she makes and creates is vegan and there's no leather. She was wearing a dress that night when we did a shoe signing, that looked like a leather dress and it wasn't leather. But I finally asked her during that evening, I said, "Well, what is that shoe made of? Is it made out of cauliflower or it what?"
Stan Smith:
I never did get an answer from her, but she created a shoe that had her picture on one tongue, and my picture on the other tongue, and so we would sign the shoe that had our picture on it, to the fans that came that night. And the last fan that came into the room, was a lady about five foot two, I would say, and she put her leg up on the table and said, "Please sign this." And I said, "That's a good effort for you to get your leg that high on the table, but that's the wrong shoe. I'm on the other shoe." So Madonna had to put her other shoe on the table and I signed her shoe for her.
Josh King:
Speaking of Madonna, Phoebe Philo of Celine helped the sneaker get its big second life in 2015, and those of us old enough to remember David Bowie wearing them, would argue that they went mainstream far earlier, but your shoes have been worn by everyone from actual royalty to Jay-Z, even Naomi Campbell wearing nothing else at all. For you, what was the most memorable run-in that the human Stan Smith has had with the shoe Stan Smith?
Stan Smith:
Well, I think that, certainly, that time with Stella and Madonna was pretty interesting. Also, I've given some shoes to Kate and William for their kids, and also Megan. And so I actually signed a shoe for Louis last Wimbledon. And right before the final, I'd signed the shoe, I was in the Royal box, only a couple steps from Kate and William. We're just about a minute from the match, the start, and there was a lull and she was looking my direction, I caught her eye, and I had the shoes that I just signed and I said, "Well, hey, Kate, I got this shoe for you for Louis." And so I handed it to her and there must have 20 or 30 photographers that took a shot of this. And one of them got a very clear shot of, "To Louis, from Stan Smith." As I was handing it to her. And that was kind of a fun moment because it went viral the next day in all the newspapers.
Josh King:
I read an article, Stan, from a couple years ago, about the fashion impact of the shoes that also mentioned the ironic twist that, I think, your niece was once kicked out of gym class for wearing Stans since they're not considered athletic shoes anymore, which begs the obvious question; when the 73-year-old Stan Smith takes the court in Hilton Head, what are you currently wearing?
Stan Smith:
I'm wearing one of the versions, usually. In fact, sometimes I wear some of the new shoes that have some bells and whistles, that are a little more supportive. In fact, when people ask me, "Should I wear your shoe playing tennis?" I say, "No, there are shoes out there that Adidas is making that are much more supportive than my shoes were." But when my niece, the story you're telling about my niece in PE, when the teacher said, "You can't wear that shoe because it's a fashion shoe." She said, "Well, my uncle won Wimbledon wearing that shoe." And the PE teacher had to, I think, step down. But it's been fun to see people wearing the shoe on the court, but a lot of times I'll be wearing some of the newer shoes that are a little more supportive. I wear my other shoes, they're not my working shoes.
Josh King:
When your career ended, Stan, you went into coaching. What drew you to mentoring the next generations of players? And who were some of your own coaches or luminaries in the sport? Like Pancho Segura, or the 2020 International Tennis Hall of Fame contributor candidate, Dennis Van Der Meer, that you looked to for guidance?
Stan Smith:
Well, when I was growing up, I went to a tennis clinic organized by the Pasadena Tennis Patrons, and we went to Pasadena High School every Saturday morning from 8:00 to 12:00. And Pancho Segura was hired, that was one of the fortunate things, to have somebody like him to actually mentor me between the ages 15 to 18. But at the end of the 12:00 period, each of us had to teach for an hour on the court, for beginners. And so the motto was, "Each one, teach one." So I learned, at that point, two things. One is, I learned a little bit about trying to translate what I knew, to somebody who was an absolute beginner on their level. And secondly, I learned to give back to the game. And so I kind of took that along, when I stopped playing, I got involved with the USTA player development program and was a director of coaching.
Stan Smith:
And it was really fun to work with some of the top players in the United States, as they were coming up to the ranks. And try to just give them a little bit of a guidance along the way, of what it would take to become a good player. And we had some great coaches that were working with us, but you mentioned one of the contributors, Dennis Van Der Meer, actually lives on Hilton Head. And has been here almost as long as I had, and unfortunately he passed away last year, but he made a big impact on coaches as well.
Stan Smith:
So coaching is very important. And one of the interesting thing about coaches is, who is the most important coach? Is it the first coach you have as a beginner? Or is it the coach you might have on the pro tour? And there's a lot to be said for that first coach, because if you don't have a great first coach that really makes it fun, that makes it interesting, that really inspires you to come back and have a second lesson, you may never get involved in the game. And so, coaching at every level is important, but those beginning coaches are so important to get the kids into the game. And then, of course, you want to refine the good players as they get older, and those very fine points on the pro tour that makes a difference of winning and losing, can be generated by a very good coach.
Josh King:
I mean, you may never even get into the game and then you lose all hope of getting to the Hall of Fame itself, and speaking of the Hall of Fame, Stan, the other candidate for the contributor category this year, is actually a group of people, these are The Original Nine. Last month also marked the 50th anniversary of the start of women's professional tennis. What are your memories of how the sport reacted to women coming into the pro ranks in 1970?
Stan Smith:
Well, it was interesting because I was pretty involved in that whole situation. In fact, when I got the privilege of calling everybody who gets nominated to be on the ballot, and so when I talked to Rosie Casals, I said, "Congratulations, The Original Nine are now going to be on the ballot." And I said, "What do you remember then?" She said, "Well, you know, it's interesting because the tournament in Los Angeles that Jack Kramer was running, had men and women." But the women's prize money, I think, was about a third or so of the men's. And so that's when the women signed that contract for $1 bill. And the next tournament they played, which was the same time as our LA tournament, was in Houston. And Rosie told me that she won the tournament.
Stan Smith:
I won the tournament in LA, she won the tournament in Houston, and they gave her $300 more in prize money for the winner of the Houston tournament, just to make a point that the women were now trying to establish their own tour. My wife was a very good tennis player and so I followed the women quite a bit. But the women were not drawing as many fans and there weren't as many sponsors involved, but they got some help with sponsorship and it continued to grow. And now we're seeing equal prize money at all the Grand Slam events, and also maybe more importantly, equal billing on the center courts of the Grand Slam events, as close as possible.
Josh King:
I return to the Battle of the Sexes with the release of the 2017 Emma Stone, Steve Carrell film that celebrated that famous 1973 King, Bobby Riggs match at the Houston Astrodome. At the time, Stan, you were working your butt off, trying to hold onto your number one world ranking. What did the pros of that era make of what King and Riggs were doing, perhaps turning the sport into this sort high wire act?
Stan Smith:
Well, it was very interesting, to say the least. You got Billy Jean, who had the guts... I mean, she actually says that she was prompted into doing this challenge because Margaret Court had lost to Bobby Riggs, in that pretty dominating fashion. I think that Margaret was overwhelmed by Bobby's mouth and his racket, and Billy Jean was not as afraid of his mouth and his racket, and really wanted to make a statement for women. And so that was... I knew a lot of the guys that knew Bobby Riggs, I knew Bobby Riggs myself. In fact, I'll never forget the day we were playing golf and he came up to me and he said, "Stan, I got the big C." I said, "Bobby, what's the big C?" And he said, "I've got cancer." And I didn't even know at that time, it wasn't even kind of related to it. So he fought that for a long time with supplements and health things.
Stan Smith:
But he was quite showman. And he actually got kicked out of most clubs in New York area, because of his golf. Because he was hustling on the golf course. It was quite a scene. And after that match, my wife, Margie, was at Princeton and she was on the women's varsity team. She actually never lost a match on the women's varsity team at Princeton, the first class of women. And so they made a big deal and she ended up playing the number one junior varsity men's player. And they had me come in-
Josh King:
That was Jeffrey Lewis-Oakes, right?
Stan Smith:
That's right. Jeff Oakes. And they had me umpire the match, which was not a good situation. We were dating 1973, and we got married in '74. So I was a little uncomfortable, I was actually giving Jeff a couple tips, and maybe dropshotting a little bit more to supporting the male side of it. But it had about 500 people watching that match. And Jeff won the match, but it was close.
Josh King:
I believe it was Margie's only collegiate loss. How did you both meet? And besides a shared interest, was it helpful that you both knew what it took to succeed in high level athletics?
Stan Smith:
Well, we actually didn't actually meet. But she ball-boyed for me when she was 13, I was 17, at the Nassau Country Club near Locust Valley, where she lived. And so she went home that day, and her mother asked her who she ball-boyed for, and she said, well, she ball-boyed for me. And her mother said, "Did you meet him?" And she said, "No." And she said, "Well, wait until you're 18 year years old, that difference of four and a half years, won't be such a big deal." And ironically, she went to school in California, we were in a tournament at the LA Tennis Club, and on her 18th birthday, I took her out for the first time, not knowing the story about what her mother had said. But it was about, I guess... What? Another six years or so, we got married. But we met through tennis in Southern California, then the women and the men played a lot of summer tournaments on the grass.
Stan Smith:
And I remember playing in Philadelphia and in Baltimore and in Boston... I'm not sure the women actually were in Boston, but certainly in New York. And so she knew about tennis, she was a very good player, she was borderline for going on the pro tour and she ended up going in the men's pro tour with me when we got married. But it was a time of, really, the women starting to... This, of course, when The Original Nine started up and Billy Jean kind of led the way, and then Chrissie and Martina, I think, after Steffi and a lot of other great players came along, that have now established the game permanently for the women.
Josh King:
When you and Margie finally did settle down, you headed to Hilton Head, South Carolina, to start Smith Stearns Tennis Academy, and what about the island made that the right place for a kid from Pasadena to settle?
Stan Smith:
Well, Charles Fraser, who created Sea Pines Resort, he studied the trends and statistics of what was going on, and he realized that tennis is getting popular in the early seventies. And so he wanted to get a touring pro to promote this resort. And the second year I was there, we had the CBS Tennis Classic of men's event in which, I think, Rosewall won the first event beating Newcombe, and then Laver beat me the next event in the finals. And then after that, we had 25 years of the Family Circle Magazine Cup, and a women's event, only on NBC, which was probably the fifth largest event for women, after the four Grand Slams every year. And then we had other men's events, as well as senior events after that.
Stan Smith:
And so I fell in love with the resort, with Hilton Head Island itself, when I came here. And now it's coming on 50 years of being... I'm still the touring pro, or they call me an ambassador, they call me a lot of things. But it's been a pretty special place to raise our four kids, and we started the academy in 2002, so that's been almost 20 years. And that's been fun, because I get on the court with these kids, I hit with them occasionally.
Stan Smith:
Yesterday, I hit with this 11-year-old girl, we kept a lot of balls in play. It's fun to see them improve and to, hopefully, give them a couple things that can make a difference in their game. And as we talked about a while ago, the key thing is to really make it fun for them at this early stage. There's so much pressure on kids today, with academics and now with this COVID, and their social lives, and their relationships with other boys and girls. I mean, it's really, really difficult. And so we try to make it as fun as possible, as well as working really hard.
Josh King:
After the break, Stan Smith, inductee and President of the International Tennis Hall of Fame, and I will discuss this year's player Hall of Fame slate. We're back to talk about that, right after this.
Speaker 12:
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Josh King:
Welcome back. Before the break, Stan Smith, inductee and President of the International Hall of Fame, and I were discussing his career, the iconic shoes that bear his name and the contributor category candidates for the 2020 International Hall of Fame Class. One of your fellow inductees to the Hall of Fame, is the great Arthur Ashe. We mentioned Arthur earlier, died at the age of 49 back in 1993. I think your first professional encounter with him was a 46 - 26 loss at the Southern California Championship in 1966, you then lost to him in the finals of Brisbane in 1968, then finally beat him in the finals of Melbourne in '69. What was he like to play against? And what's his legacy today?
Stan Smith:
Well, in my opinion, he had two career, as far as his style of play. The first one was kind of a slashing hit-and-miss type of a style, where he would just go for shots. He had a big serve, kind of a whiplash serve. He was not a big, strong guy but he had tremendous strength as well as timing, and he would just blow the ball by you. In fact, that first match you mentioned, it was very funny because he'd actually become a bit of a thinker, even at that point in time, but generally he just was going for shots. But I was standing way back to return his serve, as I'd heard about this great serve.
Stan Smith:
And so he was serving kick serves to me, were getting really high to my back hand, and I was so far back, I couldn't do anything and so I finally figured out in the second set and moved forward. And then he blasted a ball by me again. But in general, he was just a hard hitter and went for shots, and he would either be on or off. If he was on, the match was on his racket because he was dictating. If he was off, he had a chance. And then later, after he had a foot injury, he came back and he became a more thoughtful player, and he became more strategic.
Stan Smith:
He became, actually, more aggressive in a way, by coming to the net more and putting pressure on you as a player, but not just going for shots from everywhere on the court. And so he became a better player, in fact, that's when he beat Jimmy Connors. He played a very thoughtful match against Jimmy, kind of softballing him, hitting a wide slicer, which he did so well anyway. But then softballing and not getting to hard exchanges with Jimmy, which Jimmy loved. And so that was the beginning of his thoughtful stage of his career.
Stan Smith:
Now, the tennis was great, but as an individual, he was even more impactful in society, and he was a tremendous friend. He was empathetic to... I remember one time I lost in Australia in the first round after I'm thinking I might even win the tournament, and he just dropped me a note and said, "Bad luck, keep up your hard work." Sort of thing. And he was one of my competitors, I wasn't like a coach or anything like that. So he was empathetic in that way, I think the fact that all the stuff that he went through. His father was a policeman, he taught him to respect people no matter who they were, and he was put through terrible situations. I remember being in Houston where Houston Country Club, or it's the River Oaks Country Club and it's a very exclusive club, and they wouldn't let him change in the men's locker room.
Stan Smith:
He had to go to the junior locker room, which was right next to the tennis courts. And he handled those things unbelievably well, didn't let it stress him and just moved on. He was always in a situation where a lot of white people thought he was a racist and a militant, and a lot of black people thought he was an Uncle Tom. And so he was always walking that tight line, playing in a primarily white sport, and having to deal with these issues. And he was never static, he was always doing something. He wrote the trilogy of the black athlete, he wrote several books in instruction books, as well as other books that spoke about his passion for racial justice.
Stan Smith:
And so he made a huge impact on the tennis world, but also the last few years that he lived, he obviously wasn't playing much tennis, but he was interacting, supporting the Heart Foundation and also Aids and HIV prevention, and he also had some other injuries along the way so he had some tough times. He was married on crutches, in New York, at the UN Chapel. So he had a lot of difficulties during the last part of his life. I remember him saying to me one time, he said, "What are you taking those pills?" I said, "I'm taking vitamin C." He says, "What are you taking pills for? I don't take any pills." The last few years of his life, that's all he did, was take pills and try to save his situation. Had he gotten through, maybe at 10 years later, I think he... Who knows? He would've been, possibly, like Magic Johnson, maybe still alive today. But that was a sad day.
Josh King:
Stan, we've been talking about all these players and all these cities that tennis has taken you to. What kind of privilege did that represent for you as a young man coming up from USC? And, I guess, how much do you miss global travel as a result of COVID? And being the ambassador of the sport that you've always been?
Stan Smith:
Well, one of the things that was interesting is, one of my good friends was a basketball player at USC, and after his junior year, he said, "I've been to Hawaii, I've been to Detroit, I've been to New York, I've been to Houston." And I said, "Oh, that's great. I've just been, for the third time, I've been to Paris, I've been to Australia playing Davis Cup." Tennis provides you the opportunity to play around the world. It's the second most international sport after soccer, or the Europeans call it football. But you can go anywhere in the world, just bring your racket and a pair of Stan Smith shoes and you can play on any country in the world, and hopefully find a game. So it's been an unbelievable privilege for me to be able to travel around the world.
Stan Smith:
And then we've done state department tours. Like I mentioned before, Arthur and I went to six countries in Africa, we went to Southeast Asia and visited Vietnam in Laos and Burma and places like that, that were shut to the average tourist. But we did that, representing the United States, and of course, playing Davis Cup. I was on the team for 10 years, and we were able to win seven times with different... Arthur was my partner in crime early on, and then later, John McEnroe, Peter Fleming, Vitas Gerulaitis. It was a fun time to play on a Davis Cup team representing the country, especially playing outside the country.
Josh King:
Stan, you then become President of the International Tennis Hall of Fame, I think back in 2011. How did you become involved with the Hall? I assume it began with your induction back in 1987?
Stan Smith:
Well, one of the things about the International Tennis Hall of Fame, is that it really is comprised of, arguably, the best players who have ever played the game. And even players like Sampras, who are locked to get into the Hall of Dame, got very emotional when they realized and giving their speech, thanking their friends and family for supporting them, to allow them to get to that stage, but also realizing that all those players that came ahead of them, like a Don Budge and Fred Perry and Althea Gibson and Rod Laver, Roy Emerson, all these great players in the past, that are in the Hall of Fame. And so, when I was inducted in the Hall of Fame, my class was pretty special, and that was Billy Jean King, Dennis Ralston, Alex Olmedo... Dennis Ralston and Alex Olmedo both, of course, went to USC. Billy Jean King was from Southern California, and then a kid from Sweden named Borg.
Stan Smith:
So that was a pretty nice class of five people that were inducted that year in 1987. I was in a a total lock to get in. I won two grand slams and a few Davis Cup matches and a few titles and signals and doubles, so I really appreciated the fact that I was voted in. And then a couple years ago... Actually almost 10 years, nine years ago, exactly. I was asked to be the President of the Hall of Fame. So it gave me an opportunity to really continue to promote the Hall of Fame and to try to preserve the history of the game and to inspire young players as well. So I've also been the chairman of the nominating committee, the Enshrinement Nominating Committee. And so we have a couple stages; people nominate a player or a contributor to be in the Hall of Fame, and then we have a committee that kind of vets those people.
Stan Smith:
If someone's a local great, but not really international level, we take those people out, then we have a meeting of 23 people at Wimbledon every year, of Hall of Famers, historians, or media, and then we decide who's going to be on the ballot. And then we put the ballot out. We just have announced the ballot for this year. Unfortunately, this year's class of 2020 were not inducted, Ivanišević and Conchita Martínez, because we didn't have the tournament, we didn't have the induction ceremony. But they'll be inducted next year with the class of 2021. And this year, we have five players that are on the ballot, and two contributors. We talked already about The Original Nine and Dennis Van Der Meer as contributors, we actually changed the rules that you could have a group. We did that this last year.
Stan Smith:
So that's where The Original Nine is now eligible to be nominated, and our committee put them on the ballot. We're going to do it every four years for contributors. So we're trying to become a very select pioneers or visionaries of the game. And there's so many people who have contributed to the game, but we're trying to make this a very exclusive club of contributors. And then on the player's side, we have Lleyton Hewitt, whose record is actually kind of similar to mine. He didn't play Davis Cup as much, and he didn't win as many titles, but he won the US Open, he won Wimbledon, he did play Davis Cup and won for Australia. And he's been a great player internationally, and now he's the Davis Cup Captain for Australia. So he's probably the top person, he's number one in the world for 80 weeks.
Stan Smith:
And then we also have Juan Carlos Ferrero, who is new this year. He won the French Championships, was number one in the world. Lisa Raymond, who won 11 doubles championships, six in women's doubles and five in mixed doubles, and was number one in the world for 137 weeks. And then we have two players that were on the ballot the last two years, Jonas Björkman, who was one of my favorite guys. He was a number four in the world in singles, but he also won nine doubles championships, and was number one in the world in doubles, and played Davis Cup. And Sergi Bruguera is the other player from Spain, he won the French Open twice.
Stan Smith:
My biggest accomplishment at the French Open was to have a couple of great meals, but he's won the tournament twice. And so he also was a Olympic silver medalist. And so, those are the five players and the people can go online to vote, tennisfame.com. And I just voted last week, I won't tell you who I voted for, but it wasn't easy to make the decision. But you can go online, it's very simple. They've done a great job now updating this voting thing. It's the third year where fans can vote, and the person who has the most votes is going to get three extra percentage points. And so, let's say, Juan Carlos Ferrero is the number one vote getter, and he has 72% from the voting group, which is made up of historians, Hall of Famers and the media, that's going to take place pretty soon, but the fan voting, if he's number one, he is going to get three extra points so he is going to have from 72 to 75, and that will get him into the Hall of Fame.
Stan Smith:
You have to get 75% of the votes of the voting groups, which is a voting group plus the fan group voting. The second place person will get 2% and the third place person will get 1%. So the fans do have an effect of who's going to be voted in, but the voting group is the group that's going to make the biggest difference of who's going to get in the Hall of Fame. And it could be all five of these players, or it could be none of these players. They have to get 75%, and we're very, very strict on that. If somebody gets 74%, they're not in. And so that's what it's looking like this year, and it's great for the fans to get a chance, fans from all of over the world can vote.
Stan Smith:
And depends upon who's on the ballot as to... Like Li Na was voted in year before last and she got a lot of votes from China, and I doubt as many Chinese people will vote for these five players. But I think that Spain's going to have a lot of people voting. We're trying to get the word out to the tennis fans around the world, that there is a Hall of Fame and that we're going to recognize honor and have a great legacy for these great players from their countries. And Spain already has Manuel Santana... They have Manolo Santana and Conchita Martínez. And so we've got two players here that could add on to that as far as the Spain is concerned. Of course, the Australians have got a lot of good players in there, and it seemed like every year they had at least two good or great players. And so, Lleyton Hewitt, I think, has a good chance to join his compatriots there down under.
Josh King:
Well, with all this online voting participations, Stan, I hope You Know Who just doesn't try and dismiss it as a great, big hoax. But we'll see how the voting-
Stan Smith:
Well, Josh, I expect you to vote today if you haven't voted already.
Josh King:
I will be going on after you and I hang up, sir, believe me. I'm going to exercise my privilege here and put in my votes. But there are a couple players who you might think would be soon up for induction, but they're still out on the court playing their behinds off, tennis players have historically peaked in their twenties. But as of today, Federer and Serena Williams, both 39, are still ranked in the top 10. Do you think these two are just outliers or is science extending careers?
Stan Smith:
I think we're going to see more and more players extending their careers because of science and because of... If you want to get a little bit of cash in your pocket, that's certainly one thing. But the great players, I don't think money is that critical in decisions they make. The great players are looking for Grand Slam titles. If you're going to say to Djokovic, "Do you want to win another $10 million or do you want to win Roland-Garros? Or the Australian? Or pass Roger Federer in his number of Grand Slam titles?" He would, he wouldn't even blink. He would say, "I want the titles." And so that's a great thing about the great players, is they're out there trying to play their very best tennis, they're open to make changes, to do whatever they can to get a bit of an edge over the players that they're playing against.
Stan Smith:
And so, I do want to mention one other thing too, about the Hall of Fame, and that we do have a wheelchair division, and we've had, I think, five wheelchair players inducted in the Hall of Fame. We do that every four years as well. And so those players are phenomenal to watch and if you'd never watched a wheelchair match, you've got to do that because these players, both men and women, can really play well. But players have to be retired from the sport for five years before they're eligible to be nominated for the Hall of Fame. And we had one strange situation where Martina Hingis was inducted in the Hall of Fame because she had not been making a significant impact on the women's game for five years... And singles. The next day, she entered the tournament in LA, and within about a year and a half, she was ranked number one in doubles, in the world. And so that was an odd situation, but normally the players are really finished with their careers when they are up for nomination.
Josh King:
Well, with names on the ballot like Lisa Raymond, Lleyton Hewitt, Sergi Bruguera, Jonas Björkman and Juan Carlos Ferrero, there is a lot to choose from. I'll certainly be going online to vote myself at vote.tennisfame.com, to cast my ballot after our conversations, Stan. It has been such a pleasure, from that first time I saw you on the court at Longwood, to today looking at you at Hilton Head against your trophy case. It's great honor, sir.
Stan Smith:
Well, thank you, Josh. I appreciate all you're doing about tennis. I mean, it sounds like you know the game as well as most people I've met. So keep up the work.
Josh King:
Well, as a kid, listening to Bud Collins for so long, who can avoid that? That's our conversation for this week. Our guest was Stan Smith, President of the International Tennis Hall of Fame and namesake of the sweet sneakers on my feet right now. If you like what you heard, please rate us on iTunes so other folks know where to find us. And if you've got a comment or a question you'd like one of our experts to tackle on a future show, email us at [email protected], or Tweet at us @ICEHousePodcast. Our show is produced by Pete AsCh with production assistance from Ken Abel and Ian Wolf. I'm Josh King, your host, signing off from the library of the New York Stock Exchange, wearing my Stan Smiths. Thanks for listening. Talk to you next week.
Speaker 1:
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